Date   

Re: Question: foliage, vhf

Mike WB2FKO
 

Interesting to note that W7GJ has carved out a patch of Montana forest for his VHF aluminum:


Lots of foliage there.

On May 4, 2019, at 10:49 AM, lewisre@... wrote:

I would suggest a series of tests with other 6 meter stations first.  Also if possible you might compare performance  with 10 and 2 meters. 

Dick, K5RHR, DM65uv


 

On 2019-05-03 13:20, Bruce Draper wrote:

I put up my 6-mtr yagi antenna this morning, but now I'm thinking about moving it. It's on a tripod on my roof, about 30 feet off the ground (good) but only 15 feet from and directly pointed into dense cottonwood trees (bad?). I don't think it matters much on HF, but I'm guessing that it's not great on 6 meters (and much worse on UHF). There are a couple other places on the flat roof where I could put it, but the best one is directly above the radio room and I bet there will be RFI problems on both RX and TX. 

 
My question to you VHF experts: Is the absorption on 50 MHz by trees bad enough to make me want to move the antenna? 
 
   -Bruce AA5B
 


Re: Question: foliage, vhf

lewisre@...
 

I would suggest a series of tests with other 6 meter stations first.  Also if possible you might compare performance  with 10 and 2 meters. 

Dick, K5RHR, DM65uv


 

On 2019-05-03 13:20, Bruce Draper wrote:

I put up my 6-mtr yagi antenna this morning, but now I'm thinking about moving it. It's on a tripod on my roof, about 30 feet off the ground (good) but only 15 feet from and directly pointed into dense cottonwood trees (bad?). I don't think it matters much on HF, but I'm guessing that it's not great on 6 meters (and much worse on UHF). There are a couple other places on the flat roof where I could put it, but the best one is directly above the radio room and I bet there will be RFI problems on both RX and TX. 

 
My question to you VHF experts: Is the absorption on 50 MHz by trees bad enough to make me want to move the antenna? 
 
   -Bruce AA5B
 


Re: Question: foliage, vhf

Keith Morehouse
 

Look up document ITU-R P.833-9 for the actual numbers, but, IMO, it's really bad at 432, of some concern at 222 & 144 and not much of a worry at 50 MHz unless you're literally buried in foliage.

BTW, below 100 MHz, it's considerable worse with vertical polarization then horizontal, but still negligible

-W9RM

Keith Morehouse
via MotoG


On Fri, May 3, 2019, 1:20 PM Bruce Draper <bruceaa5b@...> wrote:
I put up my 6-mtr yagi antenna this morning, but now I’m thinking about moving it. It’s on a tripod on my roof, about 30 feet off the ground (good) but only 15 feet from and directly pointed into dense cottonwood trees (bad?). I don’t think it matters much on HF, but I’m guessing that it’s not great on 6 meters (and much worse on UHF). There are a couple other places on the flat roof where I could put it, but the best one is directly above the radio room and I bet there will be RFI problems on both RX and TX. 

My question to you VHF experts: Is the absorption on 50 MHz by trees bad enough to make me want to move the antenna? 

   -Bruce AA5B


Question: foliage, vhf

Bruce Draper
 

I put up my 6-mtr yagi antenna this morning, but now I’m thinking about moving it. It’s on a tripod on my roof, about 30 feet off the ground (good) but only 15 feet from and directly pointed into dense cottonwood trees (bad?). I don’t think it matters much on HF, but I’m guessing that it’s not great on 6 meters (and much worse on UHF). There are a couple other places on the flat roof where I could put it, but the best one is directly above the radio room and I bet there will be RFI problems on both RX and TX. 

My question to you VHF experts: Is the absorption on 50 MHz by trees bad enough to make me want to move the antenna? 

   -Bruce AA5B


Re: NM grids on 6M

Ed
 

June Contest coming up soon. Rovers had great setups

 

Ed N5JEH

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Glenn
Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 1:41 PM
To: nmvhf@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nmvhf] NM grids on 6M

 

Hi Keith,

I might be able to help you on the DM73. I have a 6M Ringo Ranger at 20ft using 100 watts. Do have a 3 ele beam

I have not set up yet, just moved to Ruidoso last year, elevation 7,500 looking your way.

 

Glenn  NQ5X

350 Grids confirmed on 6.

 

 

On Sun, Apr 28, 2019 at 10:28 AM Keith Morehouse <w9rm@...> wrote:

Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

 

Can anybody help me out with this ?

 

Jay W9RM


Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO

 


Re: NM grids on 6M

Glenn
 

Hi Keith,
I might be able to help you on the DM73. I have a 6M Ringo Ranger at 20ft using 100 watts. Do have a 3 ele beam
I have not set up yet, just moved to Ruidoso last year, elevation 7,500 looking your way.

Glenn  NQ5X
350 Grids confirmed on 6.


On Sun, Apr 28, 2019 at 10:28 AM Keith Morehouse <w9rm@...> wrote:
Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

Can anybody help me out with this ?

Jay W9RM

Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


Re: NM grids on 6M

Ed
 

The problem today is that all the stations that are active on 6/2/432 are almost all on Digital. Very few are monitoring the SSB/CW frequencies. But normally you can find someone on the Digital calling frequencies. JMHO

 

Ed N5JEH

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Arne N7KA
Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 8:57 AM
To: nmvhf@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nmvhf] NM grids on 6M

 

It should be possible on 144 SSB and CW if he has about 9 elements and 100W.  We should not get so wrapped up in digi modes and forget there are many folks not on digi.  Start with SSB/CW and switch to digi if path/condx are a problem.  I can work W5AKU (9el on 144) running 5w in High Rolls with my 5W and 12 elements only 22ft above gnd plus we can QSO most mornings in 432 .  I have worked KC7QY who is just N of DM63 line and I think he runs 50W; have even worked him on 432 on-digi.

 

Arne N7KA

On April 28, 2019 at 1:56 PM Mike WB2FKO <mph@...> wrote:

I noticed that W3IH in DM63 has been active in the past few days on 6m digital.  I have decoded him on FT8 here in DM65.  Might be worth a try on MSK144? Mike

On 4/28/19 9:28 AM, Keith Morehouse wrote:

Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

 

Can anybody help me out with this ?

 

Jay W9RM


Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


 


 

 


Re: NM grids on 6M

Arne N7KA
 

It should be possible on 144 SSB and CW if he has about 9 elements and 100W.  We should not get so wrapped up in digi modes and forget there are many folks not on digi.  Start with SSB/CW and switch to digi if path/condx are a problem.  I can work W5AKU (9el on 144) running 5w in High Rolls with my 5W and 12 elements only 22ft above gnd plus we can QSO most mornings in 432 .  I have worked KC7QY who is just N of DM63 line and I think he runs 50W; have even worked him on 432 on-digi.


Arne N7KA

On April 28, 2019 at 1:56 PM Mike WB2FKO <mph@...> wrote:

I noticed that W3IH in DM63 has been active in the past few days on 6m digital.  I have decoded him on FT8 here in DM65.  Might be worth a try on MSK144? Mike

On 4/28/19 9:28 AM, Keith Morehouse wrote:
Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

Can anybody help me out with this ?

Jay W9RM

Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


 


 


Re: NM grids on 6M

Keith Morehouse
 

Closer is tougher, but if we can run at least one of the grids between sunrise and 8-9AM, it should be pretty easy.  As it gets later in the day, maybe we would get lucky with a weak signal mode like FT8 or JT65.

Whatever works best for you as the Rover is good for me 😀

Of course, we will try on 2 also !

-W9RM

Keith Morehouse
via MotoG


On Sun, Apr 28, 2019, 6:38 PM John Klem <klemjf@...> wrote:
I'll have the usual Moxon at 20+ feet, and 100 W.  I've made a few random MSK144 contacts with this setup between 750 and 1600 km, without much effort.  It appears we'll be at 650-700 km, which I assume will make it more difficult, so I'll also take a big battery and a good attitude.
John AA5PR


Re: NM grids on 6M

John Klem
 

I'll have the usual Moxon at 20+ feet, and 100 W.  I've made a few random MSK144 contacts with this setup between 750 and 1600 km, without much effort.  It appears we'll be at 650-700 km, which I assume will make it more difficult, so I'll also take a big battery and a good attitude.
John AA5PR


Re: NM grids on 6M

Keith Morehouse
 

That would be great, John.  Would you be able to take along some sort of gain antenna for 6M ?
I've worked guys out of their mobiles at that distance (KF2T in many NV grids) but gain is good :)

Mike, FKO, I'll drop that guy a note - thanks.

-W9RM

Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


On Sun, Apr 28, 2019 at 2:36 PM John Klem <klemjf@...> wrote:

I'm leaning toward a trip to DM73/83 for the June contest.  Some patience may be required, but I'd be happy to try on MS.

John AA5PR


Re: NM grids on 6M

John Klem
 

I'm leaning toward a trip to DM73/83 for the June contest.  Some patience may be required, but I'd be happy to try on MS.

John AA5PR


Re: NM grids on 6M

Mike WB2FKO
 

I noticed that W3IH in DM63 has been active in the past few days on 6m digital.  I have decoded him on FT8 here in DM65.  Might be worth a try on MSK144? Mike

On 4/28/19 9:28 AM, Keith Morehouse wrote:
Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

Can anybody help me out with this ?

Jay W9RM

Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


NM grids on 6M

Keith Morehouse
 

Hello all - I only need DM63, 73 & 83 for 6M Worked all NM Grids.  All of these should be easily worked on meteor scatter if the NM end is running a small beam and 100W.

Can anybody help me out with this ?

Jay W9RM

Keith J Morehouse
Managing Partner
Calmesa Partners G.P.
Olathe, CO


need more logs!

Bruce Draper
 

Today is the last day to submit NM QSO Party logs.
**Even if you had only 1 or 2 QSOs, your log is important!**

Need help getting it in the right format? Just let me know. You can send me just the QSO info and I'll take it from there.

   -Bruce AA5B
         BruceAA5B@...



New Mexico QSO Party -- Logs due this Saturday

Brian Mileshosky
 

Greetings —

This is a friendly reminder, for those of you who participated in the recent 2019 New Mexico QSO Party, that logs are due (received by email if electronic, or postmarked if hard-copy) by this Saturday — April 27.  

All participants are encouraged to submit their log, regardless of how few or many contacts you enjoyed making during the QSO Party.  Submitting your log allows us to recognize you for your participation and helps us better understand the level of participation in this year’s event.

If you are a member in good standing of a New Mexico amateur radio club, and would like your participation to also help it earn one of the special award plaques reserved only for New Mexico amateur radio clubs, don’t forget to specify your organization's name in your electronic or paper log.

For assistance and details related to submitting your logs, or to verify that your log has been received safe and sound, please visit the New Mexico QSO Party website at www.newmexicoqsoparty.org.

Thanks for participating in the 2019 New Mexico QSO Party!

73,
Brian N5ZGT


Re: New Digital Contest Mode: FT4

Mike WB2FKO
 

Quite an interesting development!

The whitepaper shows that Gaussian Frequency Shift Keying dramatically reduces the modulation bandwidth compared to FSK. This is essential to allow multiple stations to occupy the receiver passband, as is the case with FT8.  The channel bandwidth is about twice that of FT8, but their testing shows up to 50 stations can still reliably use the channel (proposed 50.318 MHz for FT4 on 6m).  It would be interesting to learn how much sensitivity is lost (how many dB?) by using GFSK compared to FSK.  Note that GFSK is an established modulation scheme:


They tested the possibility of running FT4 asynchronously, but it seems this leads to excessive channel congestion.  I suspect the Costas Arrays must still be in there to get the FEC to work.  If so, my hunch is that shorter sequences will make Internet synchronization of computers more demanding (tighter) than FT8.  I will have a look at the source code when it is made available next Monday (29 April).

WSJT-X is an open source project, but it's pretty clear that protocol development was done by private communication among a select few.  Given the large amount of noise on the WSJT mailing lists, I would have done the same for the sake of minimizing needless distraction.

FT8 and FT4 are clearly incompatible, which is why there will be separate frequencies on each band.  Will FT4 be used by 6m operators instead of SSB when the band really opens up, even in non-contest conditions?  Will it displace FT8 just as FT8 displaced JT65?

-WB2FKO

On 4/22/19 4:01 PM, Alden Oyer wrote:
"FT4 is an experimental digital mode designed specifically for radio contesting. Like FT8, it uses fixed-length transmissions, structured messages with formats optimized for minimal QSOs, and strong forward error correction. T/R sequences are 6 seconds long, so FT4 is 2.5 × faster than FT8 and about the same
speed as RTTY for radio contesting. FT4 can work with signals 10 dB weaker than  needed for RTTY, while using much less bandwidth."

CHeck out:
http://physics.princeton.edu/pulsar/k1jt/FT4_Protocol.pdf

Enjoy,
Alden Oyer, AG5S 



Re: New Digital Contest Mode: FT4

Keith Morehouse
 

 ..and the WSJT musical chairs performance moves on.

At least THIS "experimental" mode is going to have a timer in it's alpha release that will force it to stop working right before the June VHF contest...

-W9RM


Keith Morehouse
via MotoG


On Mon, Apr 22, 2019, 4:01 PM Alden Oyer <atoyer@...> wrote:
"FT4 is an experimental digital mode designed specifically for radio contesting. Like FT8, it uses fixed-length transmissions, structured messages with formats optimized for minimal QSOs, and strong forward error correction. T/R sequences are 6 seconds long, so FT4 is 2.5 × faster than FT8 and about the same
speed as RTTY for radio contesting. FT4 can work with signals 10 dB weaker than  needed for RTTY, while using much less bandwidth."

CHeck out:
http://physics.princeton.edu/pulsar/k1jt/FT4_Protocol.pdf

Enjoy,
Alden Oyer, AG5S 


New Digital Contest Mode: FT4

Alden Oyer
 

"FT4 is an experimental digital mode designed specifically for radio contesting. Like FT8, it uses fixed-length transmissions, structured messages with formats optimized for minimal QSOs, and strong forward error correction. T/R sequences are 6 seconds long, so FT4 is 2.5 × faster than FT8 and about the same
speed as RTTY for radio contesting. FT4 can work with signals 10 dB weaker than  needed for RTTY, while using much less bandwidth."

CHeck out:
http://physics.princeton.edu/pulsar/k1jt/FT4_Protocol.pdf

Enjoy,
Alden Oyer, AG5S 


NM QSO Party report, AA5B

Bruce Draper
 

AA5B @ home, Bernalillo County, low power

CW: 214 QSOs
SSB: 258 QSOs
Multipliers: 63 (states + provinces + DX countries + NM counties)
Score: 86,436

Propagation wasn't good, there were 2 periods of high noise levels from local storms, and participation was poor, but I stuck it out for 10 of the 12 hours. Having a TV right next to the station helped -- I watched the Masters' golf tournament all afternoon, followed by the semi-finals of an Ultimate Frisbee tournament ;-)  A bit of SO2R helped keep the mind active, too.

Congrats to KK6MC and N5SJ on good roves, and the other NMVHF guys who braved the conditions (K5TA, K5WO, and N2IC come to mind, but I'm sure there were others).

   73,
      Bruce AA5B
 

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